Merchants That Require PIN for credit card

Discuss the Visa & MasterCard payment networks as well as cards that operate through them.
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CC Deville
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Merchants That Require PIN for credit card

Postby CC Deville » Mon Oct 17, 2016 12:42 pm

I just went to Jimmy John's for lunch. I paid with my Navy Federal Cash Rewards Visa Signature. I was looking at the POS while the card was being run and it flashed a strange message that unfortunately I did not catch but it did look similar to something I had seen in a forum posting about how chip cards are run (Under $50, no PIN no signature, then signature then PIN or something like that). Then it asks for a PIN. My card is only about a month old and I did not choose a PIN nor was I given one in the mail. Jimmy John's made me press the red cancel button and he had me enter the card number, exp date, CVV and Zip Code to continue and it was approved.

Now, I know that Kroger and (I think) Walmart are not requiring PIN when using an EMV debit card; however, the card I used today was a credit card. I have been using my Navy Federal card for a month now; at the grocery store, Walmart etc and this was the first time this happened to me. The only other credit card I own that has PIN functionality is PenFed-but I rarely use that card so I have never had to enter a PIN.

Have any of you guys with PIN enabled (that is cards that default to signature first) credit cards encountered this? Needless to say I called NFCU when I got home and set up my PIN just in case this happens again.

It would have been nice if the US had just gone Chip + PIN like the rest of the world...that way there is no confusion. Pay Wave/Pay Pass would be nice too for small purchases like today's....


augiedog
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Re: Merchants That Require PIN

Postby augiedog » Mon Oct 17, 2016 1:34 pm

Seems like a fluke to me - maybe the cashier pressed debit by accident? Debit always uses a PIN, and the whole reason you can sign on debit purchases is because the purchase can go through the VISA or mastercard network as credit.

I personally do not like using a PIN on transactions. I don't like touching the PIN pad - who knows what kind of germs could be lurking there, and certainly nobody is cleaning them. Rare occasions I have had the keys not press. Managing the PIN on one or two cards is easy, but if you have many it can become hard to remember and change all of them. Plus, if your card uses a PIN it will always ask for it instead of using signatureless mode on smaller transactions.
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CC Deville
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Re: Merchants That Require PIN

Postby CC Deville » Tue Oct 18, 2016 6:32 pm

augiedog wrote:Seems like a fluke to me - maybe the cashier pressed debit by accident? Debit always uses a PIN, and the whole reason you can sign on debit purchases is because the purchase can go through the VISA or mastercard network as credit.

I personally do not like using a PIN on transactions. I don't like touching the PIN pad - who knows what kind of germs could be lurking there, and certainly nobody is cleaning them. Rare occasions I have had the keys not press. Managing the PIN on one or two cards is easy, but if you have many it can become hard to remember and change all of them. Plus, if your card uses a PIN it will always ask for it instead of using signatureless mode on smaller transactions.


Could be. The guy said it happens to some people. I went on to NFCU's website about their PIN feature for their cards. Apparently they do have a tertiary (no signature/PIN required, Signature then PIN) PIN option the way PenFed and Barclay's do-but they don't actually automatically issue you a PIN...PenFed made me choose a PIN for cash and purchase during the app process. Go figure. Anyway, I now have a PIN for my card. May have to go back soon to see if it happens again and if the PIN will work.

I actually like PIN. It is very, continental. LOL. I figure if Canada, Mexico, South America, Europe etc are using Chip + PIN we should at least have the option of it. I am also not one of these people afraid of NFC RFID (Paywave/PayPass). I would gladly have that on my cards for trips to a fast food joint or coffee place; small dollar things. Easier than swiping, signing. entering a PIN etc.

As an aside; 46 views but only 1 response...this board is not very popular it seems.

JustRewards
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Re: Merchants That Require PIN for credit card

Postby JustRewards » Tue Oct 18, 2016 10:04 pm

I too think this is a fluke, as US-issued chip enabled credit cards should never prompt for a PIN. I imagine it was something wrong with the POS terminal or the checkout clerk pressed a wrong button. Also, I don't think the relative lack of response means the forum isn't popular but some threads get more interest than others. Some topics seem to get tons of response, like the ones about myfico and gardening, but all forums tend to get more viewers than active posters. I haven't been on here very long but I've gotten some good answers to my questions so far.

mountaindewvoltage
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Re: Merchants That Require PIN for credit card

Postby mountaindewvoltage » Wed Oct 19, 2016 2:22 am

JustRewards wrote:I too think this is a fluke, as US-issued chip enabled credit cards should never prompt for a PIN. I imagine it was something wrong with the POS terminal or the checkout clerk pressed a wrong button. Also, I don't think the relative lack of response means the forum isn't popular but some threads get more interest than others. Some topics seem to get tons of response, like the ones about myfico and gardening, but all forums tend to get more viewers than active posters. I haven't been on here very long but I've gotten some good answers to my questions so far.


What do you mean they should never prompt for a PIN? It's up to the bank to determine if use of a PIN is required over a signature, it doesn't matter if it's a credit or a debit card and the priority is coded within the card's chip and/or stripe. A credit card can certainly have a PIN, it just means the transaction generates less revenue in terms of insert fees because the transaction carries less risk involved when it comes to potential fraud.

Just because we live in the United States doesn't mean we're not allowed to have credit cards with PIN. As a matter of fact, that's the way they should be, but I'm sure banks will find ways to reduce costs if they were ever mandated to go to PIN only... You'd lose your rewards and have to pay higher fees, or the bank/issuer could charge you a small fee to use your card (like $0.05 per transaction) or something.

The typical interlink debit card fee is 0.09% + $0.15 per transaction... I'm sure credit card would have similar fees if they were PIN only rather than 3%-3.5% of the total price of the transaction. If you purchase a $70 pair of shoes, a debit PIN transaction will cost the merchant $0.06+$0.15 = $0.21; whereas a credit card with signature will cost the merchant $2.45.



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