The Mandela effect

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4ktvs
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The Mandela effect

Postby 4ktvs » Sun Sep 18, 2016 10:48 pm

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There are many things one could easily forget but looking at this map made me think:



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I have read up on all of this and watched a few hours worth of stuff on the history of Berlin and this air lift thing. No matter how long I look at it nothing about it will ever fit what I remember about it. The nation was a little bigger in modern times and Berlin was in the middle cut in half by the Berlin wall. Half of the city was in West Germany and the other half was in East Germany.

The city that was known as cut in half by the iron Curtain is now known as the city behind the iron Curtain. I know people are going to say well you must have made a simple mistake of misremembering it as many people didn't really think about it. But I was a WW2 and cold war history person, I am willing to say I could be mistaken about many, many things but to me this is like if I got out of bed and DC was in the middle of CA instead of being on the east coast. I am not saying it's impossible I forgot but it was no small detail to me. Also I had never heard of the Berlin air lift until a week or so ago after asking around about this. It didn't even make since to me because West Berlin was inside West Germany as I remembered it.

Other smaller things that I had noticed but am %100 willing to say I remembered wrong:

1) I recalled only 4 people in the car JFK was in when he was shot in 1963, there are 6.

2) Japan northern half being about where South Korea is, it's really the southern part that is where south Korea is.

3) ET I thought said "Phone home", now ET says "Home phone" : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyFijjikkeM

Anyone have there 2 cents to throw in?


Tubpbs
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Re: The Mandela effect

Postby Tubpbs » Mon Sep 19, 2016 5:14 am

This is a relatively confusing post. The idea with the most information is about West Berlin being contained within East Germany. This was always the case. I don't really know what the confusion is or what you think has changed??

It was definitely an odd situation, but there was no where for anyone to go outside of the city. After the war, the Allies split Germany and Berlin in the same fashion (as is indicated by the map you included). This was to keep their influence over the country as well as its capital equal.

Not sure where the JFK or Japan / South Korea thing fits in here, but these are clearly things that have never changed and have always been the way that they have been...
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4ktvs
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Re: The Mandela effect

Postby 4ktvs » Mon Sep 19, 2016 12:43 pm

Tubpbs wrote:This is a relatively confusing post. The idea with the most information is about West Berlin being contained within East Germany. This was always the case. I don't really know what the confusion is or what you think has changed??

It was definitely an odd situation, but there was no where for anyone to go outside of the city. After the war, the Allies split Germany and Berlin in the same fashion (as is indicated by the map you included). This was to keep their influence over the country as well as its capital equal.

Not sure where the JFK or Japan / South Korea thing fits in here, but these are clearly things that have never changed and have always been the way that they have been...


The Mandela effect is where a person remembers X thing always being X thing but one day they find out that X thing has always been Y thing. Most of the time it's small things, but in my own book this whole idea that the city of Berlin was in the middle of East Germany blew my mind as before looking it up that is the one thing I knew would be wrong for sure.

I have read up on it so I now know the way it's always been but it won't overwrite the past memories I have of pouring over maps, History books and other things that clearly and with out question showed Berlin on the line between East and West Germany. It's a %100 disconnect from what I remember being told, shown and instructed on my whole life. I have encountered a good number of people who remember it the way I do, even one person that used to live in Germany that was even more shocked than I was to learn where it's "always" been.

Can't say what I make of it, but it is what it is I guess.

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Re: The Mandela effect

Postby CarefulBuilder14 » Mon Sep 19, 2016 1:29 pm

I never had any misconception about Berlin being anywhere other than East Germany. I learned the Berlin Airlift (from 8th grade history class) was implemented because ground vehicles weren't being allowed through Soviet-controlled areas anymore to supply West Berlin in a more efficient manner. Also, the western allies didn't race to Berlin near the end of WW2 because they thought it would inevitably end up in the Soviet region of Germany after the war, anyway.

As far as JFK, I knew there were probably at least 6. The two Kennedys and the governor and his wife in the back. They would have needed a driver (5) and there was at least one Secret Service (6) agent in the back pretty quickly...too quickly to have jumped from another car. The car kept moving, so he wasn't the driver, too.

I'm sure there are some I've been (or still am) totally wrong about, but I can't think of what the former were (and by definition wouldn't know what the latter are).
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Re: The Mandela effect

Postby 4ktvs » Mon Sep 19, 2016 4:38 pm

CarefulBuilder14 wrote:I never had any misconception about Berlin being anywhere other than East Germany. I learned the Berlin Airlift (from 8th grade history class) was implemented because ground vehicles weren't being allowed through Soviet-controlled areas anymore to supply West Berlin in a more efficient manner. Also, the western allies didn't race to Berlin near the end of WW2 because they thought it would inevitably end up in the Soviet region of Germany after the war, anyway.

As far as JFK, I knew there were probably at least 6. The two Kennedys and the governor and his wife in the back. They would have needed a driver (5) and there was at least one Secret Service (6) agent in the back pretty quickly...too quickly to have jumped from another car. The car kept moving, so he wasn't the driver, too.

I'm sure there are some I've been (or still am) totally wrong about, but I can't think of what the former were (and by definition wouldn't know what the latter are).


You bring up some details that go against what I was told and learned from history as I remember it that is. The western Allies were in a rush for Berlin because the odds were about 50/50. In the History I remember the Soviets would have never let go of land so deep inside of there captured land. This is the biggest misconception I have come across and though I have read up on it it's as alien as the idea that DC is in the middle of the state of CA while most people just tell you it's always been that way and it's some kind of wrong memory you had about it being on the east coast.

I had many conversations with people on the Berlin wall, on World war 2 and the big events of the Cold war such as the Cuban missile crisis, the Korean war and it seems like someone would have went oh yeah the Russians cut off West Berlin by land so we invaded there air space and gave them the middle finger. Berlin being on the West/East line to me was as 2nd nature to me as knowing that JFK was a one term President or that only the US landed a man on the moon in 1969.

I guess it just blows my mind that I could have been so far off the mark on something I had studied and was really interested in as a hobby. Not claiming to be infallible in fact far from it but I have just never heard of such a thing.

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Re: The Mandela effect

Postby CarefulBuilder14 » Mon Sep 19, 2016 6:13 pm

It's possible I'm wrong about the lack of a WW2 race to Berlin. It's just what I heard and part of the context in which I understood the city's (I accidentally typed "Citi's" :ppp ) location in East Germany.
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Re: The Mandela effect

Postby Tubpbs » Mon Sep 19, 2016 7:09 pm

I've studied WWI, WWII and post war events pretty substantially.

The Western Allies did slow down when they hit the German border in the west because they knew Russia would get their first. I don't remember explicitly if it was because they knew they would reach Berlin first or just because they wanted to let them expend their resources or even if they had an agreement at some point as to where they would be meeting halfway. The U.S. definitely slowed down and relied on the Soviet Union taking the brunt of the beating to some degree.

But...Berlin certainly was never relocated into East Germany. It has always been where it's been. It is a bit of an illogical thought that they would divide Berlin when it's so far into East Germany, but it was part of the peace treaty and the idea of equally dividing the responsibility of rebuilding Germany and Berlin. The United States enacted the Marshall Plan and the Soviet Union dropped the "Iron Curtain"
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Re: The Mandela effect

Postby PhillyPhoto » Tue Sep 20, 2016 7:45 am

4ktvs wrote:The Mandela effect is where a person remembers X thing always being X thing but one day they find out that X thing has always been Y thing. Most of the time it's small things, but in my own book this whole idea that the city of Berlin was in the middle of East Germany blew my mind as before looking it up that is the one thing I knew would be wrong for sure.

This is why eye witness testimony is so unreliable. We process what we see/hear, and fill in any gaps for things we missed, or that happened too quick to remember in detail.
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