2014 the year for EMV?

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takeshi
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Postby takeshi » Mon Jan 13, 2014 9:19 am

websteth wrote:So with all of the recent hacks of cards, could 2014 be the year we finally see EMV?

Given the fraud liability shift in 2015 we were likely to see more EMV in 2014 even without the hacks.


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Postby Sevenfeet » Mon Jan 13, 2014 2:26 pm

It's sad that it usually takes something extremely bad to get people to move faster. Often with major accidents like airline crashes, things could have certainly been done before lives were lost...the lesson in "lessons learned" is usually too late. It's the same thing in this case. The data breach was worse that it could have been since the infiltration in their IT systems were at the point of sale swipe machines. Malware got installed on them somehow by an organized crime group and all of the magnetic swipe information get scanned in the clear. It was a skimming operation of massive proportions.

The irony is that the CEO of Target is now advocating for the EMV system. Guess what's not working in his stores right now...EMV.
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Postby Robrus1 » Mon Jan 13, 2014 8:28 pm

After watching people while in line in London and elsewhere in Europe, chip+pin looks considerably quicker than mag stripe and receipt, or chip+sig. Bring on the chip+pin! Now if they'd just adopt the normal hourly pay for servers and do away with tipping, I'd never have to sign another receipt haha.
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Postby websteth » Mon Jan 13, 2014 8:34 pm

Robrus1 wrote:After watching people while in line in London and elsewhere in Europe, chip+pin looks considerably quicker than mag stripe and receipt, or chip+sig. Bring on the chip+pin! Now if they'd just adopt the normal hourly pay for servers and do away with tipping, I'd never have to sign another receipt haha.


100% agree with this statement.
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Postby flan » Mon Jan 13, 2014 10:51 pm

darkguy2 wrote:Didn't they have a problem in the UK with chip & pin? Where if they got your PIN as well then the victim is liable for the charges since it is the person's responsibility to protect their PIN? It also does not make card-not-present transactions like online or phone orders more secure.


Chip and pin comes with (or is followed shortly by) a liability shift, yes. the customer is assumed to be liable. EMV is less vulnerable to fraud than magnetic stripe cards, but there are attacks, and there is still a substantial amount of fraud, which the customer usually pays for. (The EMV propaganda machine no longer insists that there's no fraud, but they down play the amount that occurs.) The problem with that is that US Federal law doesn't allow that shift in liability. The card issuer would have to prove that the customer was grossly negligent (and unless you write your pin on the card, that's nearly impossible.), or they're still on the hook.

The liability shift that will happen in the US is that starting in 2015 the merchant might be liable for fraud if they don't have a EMV terminal and the card used has an EMV chip. (The actual dates are complicated, and I don't remember all the details, some things are much later, and the date might slip still) So, yeah, expect if you have a card issued this year, or reissued this year, it will have an EMV chip. (chip and pin isn't required in the US as part of the liability shift, expect most cards to be sign only; pin cards cost more, and require better back end systems.)

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Postby luvbullmarkets » Tue Jan 14, 2014 12:16 pm

benhollberg wrote:I don't like the idea of chip and pin, I understand it's required internationally sometimes but typing in a PIN every time I buy something seems like a terrible inconvenience. I know it'll protect the issuing bank more from fraud but I'm already protected from fraud so it doesn't help me out.


Typing a pin does not take any longer than signing your name. In fact I would prefer pins since I can never get my signature right on those electronic signature pads. The only problem will be remembering all those pins for each card. Simply one pin number will make you vulnerable.
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Postby benhollberg » Tue Jan 14, 2014 8:24 pm

Robrus1 wrote:Now if they'd just adopt the normal hourly pay for servers and do away with tipping, I'd never have to sign another receipt haha.


I agree 100% agree with this. I rarely even sign receipts anymore but when it comes to tipping I'm not on board. I'd rather pay more for my food and except good service than have to tip.
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Postby samhradh » Sat Jan 18, 2014 8:19 am

Guys, I just had a thought: It's pretty surprising the Arrival doesn't have a EMV chip. Hadn't occurred to me until just now but you would think this would be a no brainer with the way they're marketing the card. I plan to contact Barclays with a formal request. If they don't hear from us, they'll continue to think we don't want EMV!
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Postby websteth » Sat Jan 18, 2014 8:44 am

samhradh wrote:Guys, I just had a thought: It's pretty surprising the Arrival doesn't have a EMV chip. Hadn't occurred to me until just now but you would think this would be a no brainer with the way they're marketing the card. I plan to contact Barclays with a formal request. If they don't hear from us, they'll continue to think we don't want EMV!

Barclaycard last I checked had no interest in moving quickly to EMV
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Postby jfinlayson » Thu Feb 13, 2014 2:49 pm

websteth wrote:Barclaycard last I checked had no interest in moving quickly to EMV


The Hawaiian Airlines World Elite MasterCard, which is issued by Barclays, now comes with a chip, as you can see from photo on their web page (link above). Furthermore, the EMV cards available in the US spreadsheet maintained by a Flyertalk user indicates that it supports Chip and PIN (in addition to Chip and Signature).

Like their Arrival card Barclays' Hawaiian Airlines card sports an $89 annual fee. But its standard rewards are 1%. Still could be a good option for people who live or frequently travel to Hawaii.

For the rest of us, this does provide evidence that Barclay clearly has some interest in supporting EMV -- including perhaps even Chip and PIN -- with cards they issue in the U.S. If they put it in the Hawaiian card, why not the Arrival?



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