Balance Transfer

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Kevin86475391
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Re: Balance Transfer

Postby Kevin86475391 » Tue Sep 22, 2015 4:41 pm

CarefulBuilder14 wrote:
Kevin86475391 wrote:
gregshelley@scrtc.com wrote:Thanks... If I go with carefulbuilder's suggestion of get a 2nd BT card, which one's are best and will give the best cL? I am thinking the BOA plain visa card might be good 18 months no apr & 3% BT fee.

That sounds like a good option, but you might also want to consider the Chase Slate - which as I recall from another thread you already have for yourself? Your wife could get one too if she doesn't have it. It offers 15 months 0% APR, but a $0 balance transfer fee as long as you make the BT within 60 days of opening the account. So 3 months fewer at 0% APR, but no fee within 60 days.

Not possible since Freedom and Slate are both Chase cards.


Ohh, I was unaware of that restriction. Thanks for the info.


gregshelley@scrtc.com
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Re: Balance Transfer

Postby gregshelley@scrtc.com » Tue Sep 22, 2015 5:30 pm

Not possible since Freedom and Slate are both Chase cards.[/quote]

Ohh, I was unaware of that restriction. Thanks for the info.[/quote]

Yeah, I tried that with my Freedom to Slate for Utilization purposes, and that was a big NOPE!
Discover it $3.5K
BOA CR Visa Sig. $25K
Chase Freedom Visa $2K
Chase MRP Visa Sig. $5K
Cap 1 Vent Visa Sig. $13K
Citi HH Visa Sig. $10.1K
AMEX Plat NPSL
AMEX BCP $20K
AMEX Gold Delta SM $8K
BC AR + WEMC $3.5K
Cap 1 Spark Cash Bus Visa Sig. $4k
Chase Ink Cash Busin Visa Sig. $5K

gregshelley@scrtc.com
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Re: Balance Transfer

Postby gregshelley@scrtc.com » Tue Sep 22, 2015 8:02 pm

CarefulBuilder14 wrote:I have to wonder if opening a different BT card might be better, and doing two small BTs (one to Citi, one to the other issuer's card).

$18k is a big BT for which Citi might not have an appetite when they only approved less than half of that originally.


We went with the Citi Simplicity card, 21 month no Apr BT, 3% BT fee. She was approved for 6,600 CL. Thanks guys for the Help. How much would you put on each card? Citi Diamond Preferred $8,800 CL, Citi Simplicity $6,600 CL total Balance on Freedom card $18,736
Discover it $3.5K
BOA CR Visa Sig. $25K
Chase Freedom Visa $2K
Chase MRP Visa Sig. $5K
Cap 1 Vent Visa Sig. $13K
Citi HH Visa Sig. $10.1K
AMEX Plat NPSL
AMEX BCP $20K
AMEX Gold Delta SM $8K
BC AR + WEMC $3.5K
Cap 1 Spark Cash Bus Visa Sig. $4k
Chase Ink Cash Busin Visa Sig. $5K

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Vattené
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Re: Balance Transfer

Postby Vattené » Thu Sep 24, 2015 4:25 pm

gregshelley@scrtc.com wrote:We went with the Citi Simplicity card, 21 month no Apr BT, 3% BT fee. She was approved for 6,600 CL. Thanks guys for the Help. How much would you put on each card? Citi Diamond Preferred $8,800 CL, Citi Simplicity $6,600 CL total Balance on Freedom card $18,736


Glad she got approved for another card, particularly another one from Citi. Do you anticipate any major credit needs in the future (such as a car loan, etc)? Also, are both the Diamond Preferred and Simplicity cards 21 months with no APR?

I would load as much as of the Freedom balance as possible to each of the new Citi cards with the long-term goal of getting that revolving balance to zero and always paying in full on future spending. Regularly carrying a balance will cost a lot and isn't sustainable over time since you're not living within your means. Maxing out both of these new cards will mean her credit takes a hit in the short term. If any credit needs come up perhaps they could be in your name only? Over time it will be the most beneficial as you can aggressively tackle that balance and save on interest charges.

Anyway, I'd recommend taking advantage of those balance transfer opportunities. Don't use any of the cards for regular spending. Paying by debit card will force you not to outspend your income and will keep tackling this debt much simpler. If you can use the entire credit lines (I've never done a balance transfer, so I'm not aware of any caps or limits that would prevent this), you could transfer $6,407 to Simplicity and $8,543 to Diamond Preferred, leaving $3,786 of the balance on Freedom. You'll have to make minimum payments on all accounts to keep them in good standing, but get that small Freedom balance to zero as soon as possible because that's where you'll be paying interest.

Math won't be to exact to the penny, but hopefully it will be illustrative:


Can you afford to pay off the entire balance within 21 months? It would mean paying a total of about $893 a month towards the balance (not counting interest charges from Freedom), but across three different cards (if not, pay down the Freedom to $0, then pay down the Citi card with the highest APR to $0, then pay down the Citi card with the lowest APR to $0, all across the shortest time frame you can manage). Perhaps you could make a spreadsheet just to spell everything out and list, for example:
  • Month 1 | $893 total payment | $25 to Diamond Preferred | $25 to Simplicity | $843 to Freedom
and so on until you get the Freedom to $0 (about 5 months).
Next tackle the BT on whichever Citi card has the highest regular APR. Say it's the Simplicity. You could pay $868 a month to it and $25 to Diamond Preferred until the Simplicity is at $0 (about 8 months). Finally, devote your $893 "entire payment" to Diamond Preferred until it is at $0.

It will take organization, budgeting, and determination, but you can get this balance to $0 - even if not within 21 months total - while training yourself to always PIF in your regular spending. Then, you can start earning rewards on your regular spending :D

Best of luck!
-Vattené
FICO-8:
EX - 805 (2/17) | TU - 787 (2/17)
Primary Cards:
American Express EveryDay - $20,000 (10/14)
Discover it - $23,000 (2/14)
AU on Barclay Sallie Mae - $10,000 (8/15)
plus several store accounts of varying usefulness now

gregshelley@scrtc.com
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Re: Balance Transfer

Postby gregshelley@scrtc.com » Thu Sep 24, 2015 4:55 pm

Vattené wrote:
gregshelley@scrtc.com wrote:We went with the Citi Simplicity card, 21 month no Apr BT, 3% BT fee. She was approved for 6,600 CL. Thanks guys for the Help. How much would you put on each card? Citi Diamond Preferred $8,800 CL, Citi Simplicity $6,600 CL total Balance on Freedom card $18,736


Glad she got approved for another card, particularly another one from Citi. Do you anticipate any major credit needs in the future (such as a car loan, etc)? Also, are both the Diamond Preferred and Simplicity cards 21 months with no APR?

I would load as much as of the Freedom balance as possible to each of the new Citi cards with the long-term goal of getting that revolving balance to zero and always paying in full on future spending. Regularly carrying a balance will cost a lot and isn't sustainable over time since you're not living within your means. Maxing out both of these new cards will mean her credit takes a hit in the short term. If any credit needs come up perhaps they could be in your name only? Over time it will be the most beneficial as you can aggressively tackle that balance and save on interest charges.

Anyway, I'd recommend taking advantage of those balance transfer opportunities. Don't use any of the cards for regular spending. Paying by debit card will force you not to outspend your income and will keep tackling this debt much simpler. If you can use the entire credit lines (I've never done a balance transfer, so I'm not aware of any caps or limits that would prevent this), you could transfer $6,407 to Simplicity and $8,543 to Diamond Preferred, leaving $3,786 of the balance on Freedom. You'll have to make minimum payments on all accounts to keep them in good standing, but get that small Freedom balance to zero as soon as possible because that's where you'll be paying interest.

Math won't be to exact to the penny, but hopefully it will be illustrative:


Can you afford to pay off the entire balance within 21 months? It would mean paying a total of about $893 a month towards the balance (not counting interest charges from Freedom), but across three different cards (if not, pay down the Freedom to $0, then pay down the Citi card with the highest APR to $0, then pay down the Citi card with the lowest APR to $0, all across the shortest time frame you can manage). Perhaps you could make a spreadsheet just to spell everything out and list, for example:
  • Month 1 | $893 total payment | $25 to Diamond Preferred | $25 to Simplicity | $843 to Freedom
and so on until you get the Freedom to $0 (about 5 months).
Next tackle the BT on whichever Citi card has the highest regular APR. Say it's the Simplicity. You could pay $868 a month to it and $25 to Diamond Preferred until the Simplicity is at $0 (about 8 months). Finally, devote your $893 "entire payment" to Diamond Preferred until it is at $0.

It will take organization, budgeting, and determination, but you can get this balance to $0 - even if not within 21 months total - while training yourself to always PIF in your regular spending. Then, you can start earning rewards on your regular spending :D

Best of luck!


Thanks, that sounds like a great plan.
Discover it $3.5K
BOA CR Visa Sig. $25K
Chase Freedom Visa $2K
Chase MRP Visa Sig. $5K
Cap 1 Vent Visa Sig. $13K
Citi HH Visa Sig. $10.1K
AMEX Plat NPSL
AMEX BCP $20K
AMEX Gold Delta SM $8K
BC AR + WEMC $3.5K
Cap 1 Spark Cash Bus Visa Sig. $4k
Chase Ink Cash Busin Visa Sig. $5K

Kevin86475391
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Re: Balance Transfer

Postby Kevin86475391 » Thu Sep 24, 2015 8:04 pm

It certainly is a good plan and will save you the most money/interest...but it's not what I would do personally.

I would advise against "maxing out" a credit card because it can potentially scare creditors and cause them to take adverse action like lowering credit limits or closing unused accounts. Not just Citi either, but Chase and any other creditors may become concerned that she's 'maxed out' two credit cards (even though total debt hasn't increased).

I'd avoid transferring more than 85% of the total available CL to each card. So for example:

Citi Diamond with a CL of $8,800 would get $7,480
Citi Simplicity with a CL of $6,600 would get $5,610
Freedom would be left with $5,646

I'd also pay a bit more than minimum to the two Citi cards because only exactly the minimum can look bad to creditors and also because 85% util is still really high and it would be good to chip away at it as quickly as possible. I think your minimum payment would likely be more than $25 on a balance that high as well. Probably more like $50-$100, depending on how Citi calculates it (it varies by lender and unfortunately I'm not sure exactly how they do it). So personally I'd commit to at least $100 a month to the 2 Citi cards, and if the $900 per month payment plan (rounding up from $893) from above was realistic that would leave $700 per month to Chase, and would take about 8-9 months to pay off.

After Chase is paid off, IF you'll be able to pay off the two Citi cards during the 0% window, I'd also personally recommend splitting the payments equally between them instead OR dividing it proportionally based on their balances, that way the utilization drops more steadily on both. Plus if you'll have them both paid off before the 0% ends, it won't really matter which one has higher APR.

Anyway, this suggestion is definitely more costly than Vattené, but i feel like it's better for your wife's credit and reduces the risk of adverse action from any lenders. Just my two cents though.

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Vattené
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Re: Balance Transfer

Postby Vattené » Thu Sep 24, 2015 10:14 pm

I agree that Kevin's advice is certainly sound. Which approach you would take comes down to what is a higher priority for you and your wife: paying less money or maintaining a higher credit score through the short term. I'm very averse to debt and paying interest, so I easily come down on paying less, but both are perfectly valid.

Credit is important, but I recommended what I did because, again personally, if I had to choose between points on a credit score or dollars in a bank account I'd pick the latter in a heartbeat. Once the debt is paid off and you have a better control over your credit, the credit score will improve vastly. This is why I asked about any credit needs coming up and whether you'd be willing and able to take them solely in your name.

Assuming her finances are pretty intermingled with yours, it helps your wife that she can use you until she is through this. My wife had baddies on her credit (as in derogatory marks that are worse than a high balance & utilization) and we just had to wait for them to fall off. It wasn't until late last year that her reports were finally clean. Any credit needs we had went in my name only (fortunately, they were only a financed car after we both got out of college and a couple credit cards just for the rewards). It is possible Citi will start balance chasing, which will mean your utilization stays high while you're paying this off. How much should you want to avoid that? If it were me I wouldn't care too much, even if they closed the accounts once I got them to $0. Neither card earns rewards, so neither will be of much use after the debt has been paid. At that point, assuming you and your wife have managed all other credit responsibly, your wife will be in a position where she can pretty much get any card she wants. Plus the current month's utilization is all that matters for credit scoring purposes.

As far as how to handle the two Citi cards, Kevin's advice does make sense. I was just coming at it from the perspective of psychologically wanting to tackle one hurdle then move on to the next AND "saving" the lowest APR card for last just in case you aren't able to take care of the whole thing in 21 months.

I would strongly encourage not using either Citi card for purchases, though, and only using the Freedom if you are highly confident you can pay any current charges off in full. You want to keep what's left of the balance transfer straight until you see it to its end, and rewards have to take a backseat until you're in the habit of paying off every month in full.
-Vattené
FICO-8:
EX - 805 (2/17) | TU - 787 (2/17)
Primary Cards:
American Express EveryDay - $20,000 (10/14)
Discover it - $23,000 (2/14)
AU on Barclay Sallie Mae - $10,000 (8/15)
plus several store accounts of varying usefulness now

gregshelley@scrtc.com
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Re: Balance Transfer

Postby gregshelley@scrtc.com » Fri Sep 25, 2015 8:28 am

Thanks for all the advice guys, I think we will go for $7000 on the Diamond Preferred, and $5000 on the Simplicity. That will leave her $6765 on the Freedom, and she will not use any of her cards till we get them paid off. I will still use mine, keeping utilization below 10% and PIF on all each month, maybe that will help my score and in 8-12 months I can get the Marriot Rewards card I want and some CLI's on some accounts. My current Fico is 677 on Trans Union, and 680 on experience. My wife's is 783 on Trans Union even with high utilazation. She has an avg. of 7 years 7 months Aaoa where as my Aaoa is 2 years with an auto loan account paid off and credit cards only 2-3 months old.
Discover it $3.5K
BOA CR Visa Sig. $25K
Chase Freedom Visa $2K
Chase MRP Visa Sig. $5K
Cap 1 Vent Visa Sig. $13K
Citi HH Visa Sig. $10.1K
AMEX Plat NPSL
AMEX BCP $20K
AMEX Gold Delta SM $8K
BC AR + WEMC $3.5K
Cap 1 Spark Cash Bus Visa Sig. $4k
Chase Ink Cash Busin Visa Sig. $5K

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CarefulBuilder14
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Re: Balance Transfer

Postby CarefulBuilder14 » Fri Sep 25, 2015 6:38 pm

gregshelley@scrtc.com wrote:Thanks for all the advice guys, I think we will go for $7000 on the Diamond Preferred, and $5000 on the Simplicity. That will leave her $6765 on the Freedom, and she will not use any of her cards till we get them paid off. I will still use mine, keeping utilization below 10% and PIF on all each month, maybe that will help my score and in 8-12 months I can get the Marriot Rewards card I want and some CLI's on some accounts. My current Fico is 677 on Trans Union, and 680 on experience. My wife's is 783 on Trans Union even with high utilazation. She has an avg. of 7 years 7 months Aaoa where as my Aaoa is 2 years with an auto loan account paid off and credit cards only 2-3 months old.

I don't know what's best for you as far as keeping your finances separate or combining them. I also don't know where the $18k of debt came from - whether it was from medical debt, some emergency, or just shopping. If I had $18k of CC debt, though, I would not be planning future card apps for travel. I would extinguish and exterminate the debt, build a cash cushion, and then think about travel.

While the signup bonus and card perks do allow for free/heavily discounted hotel stays, keep in mind that travel tends to mean other non-essential expenses (at least it does for me).
Keeping indefinitely: IHG, SchwabPlat, CSP, Discover, Freedom, ED, BCE, Hyatt
May close or PC: Prestige, Arrival, BrooksBros
AA Platinum converting into Costco

Might add: Proper business card, CSR, Ritz, Delta Gold, First Tech
Letting new accounts cool off since May

gregshelley@scrtc.com
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Re: Balance Transfer

Postby gregshelley@scrtc.com » Mon Oct 05, 2015 4:32 pm

My Wife got her Citi Diamond Preferred card and BT'T $7,535.76 (Approved and subtracted from Freedom Balance) from her Chase Freedom with a Pending BT fee of $226.07. She got her Citi Simplicity card and BT'T $5,200.00 (Pending Auth.) with a $156.00 BT fee (pending). Her Current balance on her Chase Freedom card is $11,200.00, and will be down to $6,000.00 if the BT to the Simplicity card goes through.
Discover it $3.5K
BOA CR Visa Sig. $25K
Chase Freedom Visa $2K
Chase MRP Visa Sig. $5K
Cap 1 Vent Visa Sig. $13K
Citi HH Visa Sig. $10.1K
AMEX Plat NPSL
AMEX BCP $20K
AMEX Gold Delta SM $8K
BC AR + WEMC $3.5K
Cap 1 Spark Cash Bus Visa Sig. $4k
Chase Ink Cash Busin Visa Sig. $5K



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