Chase Sapphire Preferred or Barclaycard Arrival +

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sovelong
 
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Chase Sapphire Preferred or Barclaycard Arrival +

Postby sovelong » Fri Nov 14, 2014 1:12 pm

Hey guys,

Just joined the forum and this is my first question so thanks to all responses.

I'm debating between the Chase Sapphire Preferred and the Barclaycard arrival +. The bonus sign ups are about the same in my eyes so I want whichever will give me the most rewards in the long run. I definitely prefer the metallic aesthetic of the Sapphire Preferred - for whatever that's worth - but it seems this card is perhaps geared towards heavier spenders who put their funds mostly towards dining and traveling? I'm also curious how much more you get for your miles on this card but it seems the process in redeeming them is a bit more of a hassle - you have to go through Chase Ultimate Rewards? Also which card tends to give a better credit limit?

Now for the Barclaycard Arrival + you just get 2 points across the board on purchases which to me sounds better but maybe I'm missing something. That's really all the commentary I have on this card at the moment. Benefits between the two seem pretty equal aside from how you accrue points.

To give you some insight, My credit score is about 700 - perhaps a bit above that now - and I make 50K annually. I have 3 personal cards - A Visa World Points card which I hardly use but keep open because it's my oldest account at 9 years, A Visa Cash Rewards that gets me 1% on all purchases, 2% on groceries/dining, 3% on gas, and a Visa Travel Rewards card that I use on all travel purchases. I also have an Amex Gold through work. I travel domestically a few times a year and take maybe 2 international trips so the chip and pin feature on each sounds nice. That's most of my travel spending aside from my monthly metro or renting a car occasionally and taking taxis. All other things fall into everyday spending for me but I do dine out frequently and go to bars often.

Thanks for reading and any insight, I know I probably put way too much info in this post.


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djrez4
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Postby djrez4 » Fri Nov 14, 2014 4:52 pm

Thought 1 - A FICO of 700 does not guarantee you an approval for a CSP or an Arrival+.

Thought 2 - Annual fee is about the same, so consider the rewards scheme instead:

Arrival is what is called a fixed-value points system. You always earn two points per dollar. Each point is worth one penny, no matter what, when redeemed to offset a travel charge. And, you receive 10% of your points back upon redemption. So, mathematically speaking, you get 2.2 points per dollar of value, all day, every day, when redeemed toward travel expenses. Minimum redemption is $25 or 2500 points.

CSP is a hybrid points system. You earn 1-2 points per dollar, depending on spending category. Points vary in value depending on how you redeem them. You can redeem your points for cash or buy gift cards at 1¢ per point. You can purchase travel through Chase at 1.25¢ per point. Or, you can transfer to travel partners and get anywhere from 1¢-10+¢ per point depending on how you use them.

You'll probably earn more points with Arrival+. You can redeem them against a wider range of travel costs. For example, I redeemed some against a hot air balloon ride in Turkey. But, you're always stuck at that same value per point.

The CSP doesn't guarantee a high rate of return, but offers the possibility of much higher rewards if you're willing to do the groundwork to find a good redemption.
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CarefulBuilder14
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Postby CarefulBuilder14 » Fri Nov 14, 2014 6:03 pm

sovelong wrote:I travel domestically a few times a year and take maybe 2 international trips so the chip and pin feature on each sounds nice.


As far as I'm aware, CSP is Chip+Sig.

Of course, you could get the Chip+PIN no-AF Arrival as well as the Chip+Sig CSP. Or start with Arrival+ and then downgrade it to a no-AF edition (in addition to the CSP).
Warranties and sketchy merchants: Schwab Platinum
Price rewind: Costco
Travel insurance: Prestige, CSP
Perks: IHG, Hyatt
Rewards/Offers: Discover, Freedom, ED, BCE
Taxes/Misc: SPG

Limited value, might close: Arrival

Might add: First Tech, proper business card

wiivile
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Postby wiivile » Fri Nov 14, 2014 9:24 pm

If you're going to get the Arrival, get it just for the signup bonus, then cancel it, because the Citi Double Cash blows it out of the water.

The CSP is a completely different card. It's only worth it if you can really take advantage of frequent flyer programs. It generally requires a lot of work and thought to make the most out of your points. It's really hard to get more than 2 cents per point.
    Chase Sapphire Preferred Visa Signature: 11/2013, $15,000 CL
    Chase Freedom Visa: 11/2009, $4,700 CL
    U.S. Bank Cash+ Visa Signature: 11/2013, $11,200 CL

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CarefulBuilder14
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Postby CarefulBuilder14 » Fri Nov 14, 2014 9:29 pm

wiivile wrote:If you're going to get the Arrival, get it just for the signup bonus, then cancel it


Or just downgrade it to the no-AF version, and have a card with no FTFs that works as Chip+PIN.

djrez4,

What have been some of the cases in which you can get anything like 10 cents from a UR point? Everything I've examined gets like 4 cents, max - and sometimes close to just 1 cent. Are they for 'normal travel on sale', or do they involve weird connecting flights?
Warranties and sketchy merchants: Schwab Platinum
Price rewind: Costco
Travel insurance: Prestige, CSP
Perks: IHG, Hyatt
Rewards/Offers: Discover, Freedom, ED, BCE
Taxes/Misc: SPG

Limited value, might close: Arrival

Might add: First Tech, proper business card

Nixon
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Postby Nixon » Fri Nov 14, 2014 10:39 pm

Hell, why not both?
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Cre
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Postby Cre » Sat Nov 15, 2014 12:24 am

Chip = Microchip in the card?

Sig = Cardholder signature required? On the card itself, or on the receipt describing the transaction?

Chip+Sig versus Chip+PIN = ????? What is the difference, and why that would make a difference with AF?

FTF = Foreign Transactions Fees?

Help?

I get that some cards have a chip, and that many places outside of the US require a chip in order for the card to be usable in their payment processing machines. What I don't get is everything else said above.
Current Cards:
AmEx Platinum Charge: NPSL, $450 AF
AmEx Reserve Credit: $30K limit, $450 AF
Chase Slate Visa Credit: $32K limit, No AF
Future Strategy:
Near Term: Need a good MasterCard for places that won't accept AmEx or Visa
Long Term: Will downsize out of one or both current AmEx cards to reduce AFs

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CarefulBuilder14
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Postby CarefulBuilder14 » Sat Nov 15, 2014 12:31 am

Internationally, there are some places where you can only use a credit card if it has a chip and if you can provide a security PIN for it. Most US cards don't have security PINs (though more are getting them). This means there are some places (especially kiosks) where cards that have a chip but require a signature (like CSP) can't be used.

The attractive feature of the Arrival cards (and some other cards) is that they have PINs. So while the rewards may be modest, they can work in situations where a CSP wouldn't function.

The reason not to have Arrival+ and CSP (at least, on a long-term basis) is that someone who can make good use of UR points would very rarely use the Arrival+, since the CSP reward value is better. The Arrival+ would only be the card to use in situations where a Chip+PIN card was absolutely necessary. Those situations happen, but they are infrequent enough that spending on an Arrival+ would be minimal - so paying an AF for a higher rewards rate wouldn't make much sense.

On the other hand, if someone can't make good use of UR points, then that person wouldn't get any real value from a CSP.

Getting both for signup bonuses might be good, but keeping both cards and paying annual fees on both wouldn't make financial sense - at least, not unless a person was a very frequent international traveler.
Warranties and sketchy merchants: Schwab Platinum
Price rewind: Costco
Travel insurance: Prestige, CSP
Perks: IHG, Hyatt
Rewards/Offers: Discover, Freedom, ED, BCE
Taxes/Misc: SPG

Limited value, might close: Arrival

Might add: First Tech, proper business card

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djrez4
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Postby djrez4 » Sat Nov 15, 2014 12:36 am

CarefulBuilder14 wrote:djrez4,

What have been some of the cases in which you can get anything like 10 cents from a UR point? Everything I've examined gets like 4 cents, max - and sometimes close to just 1 cent. Are they for 'normal travel on sale', or do they involve weird connecting flights?


Park Hyatt Istanbul Spa King - 30,000 UR points for three nights - $450 per night normal rate, plus breakfast at $40 per person = 5.3¢/point.

Grand Hyatt Beijing Grand Suite - 15,000 UR points for two nights - $473 per night normal rate, plus breakfast at $40 per person = 6.84¢/point.

I didn't use UR points for our flights last time around, but it was 180,000 miles for what I estimated to be around $20,000 in business class flights. That's 11.1¢/point.

It's not easy, but it can be done.
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Cre
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Postby Cre » Sat Nov 15, 2014 12:45 am

Thanks CarefulBuilder14. Now that you mention it, I did receive a letter from AmEx with a PIN. I ignored it, because I thought it was only for ATMs, which I never use, for fear of fees. Are you saying that I would have to know this PIN if I were to say, rent a car in another country? I recently did rent a car in another country, and the only thing they wanted was "raised numbers" on the card.

As some of you credit aficionados might already know, the original Chase Slate Mastercard did not have raised numbers, and it was oriented sideways. It caused a lot of grief with vendors, but no one asked for a chip, they just wanted raised numbers. They still accepted the card, they just handed me a pin... not to sign, but to prick my finger for a blood/DNA sample. Ok, just kidding. They used the pen instead and handwrote on another form.

So some countries REQUIRE a PIN for transactions of goods and services, not just ATMs and cash advances?
Current Cards:
AmEx Platinum Charge: NPSL, $450 AF
AmEx Reserve Credit: $30K limit, $450 AF
Chase Slate Visa Credit: $32K limit, No AF
Future Strategy:
Near Term: Need a good MasterCard for places that won't accept AmEx or Visa
Long Term: Will downsize out of one or both current AmEx cards to reduce AFs



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