Another fraud on one of my cards...

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jeffysdad
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Another fraud on one of my cards...

Postby jeffysdad » Sun Mar 14, 2010 7:26 am

Citi contacted me about unauthorized use on a card the other day. It's been closed and a new one is coming as is the usual affidavit with fraud charges listed, etc. I've had this happen three or four times now in the last several years.

The cards are never lost/stolen, but somehow the acct. number is harvested and used. Once this happened with a card that I had never used for anything other than one balance transfer.

Anyway, I'm wondering if anyone knows whether Amex cards/numbers are less susceptible to this. My fraud experiences have only been with MC and Visa, although I have two Amex cards (one through FIA Card Services/BofA).

Further, I have a debit card that I NEVER carry and only use as an ATM card (I tried to get an ATM-only card from the bank, but that wasn't available). If crooks can harvest CC numbers so easily, what's to keep them from doing the same with debit card numbers?

It seems like the risk of having one's checking account emptied is rather great for anyone with a Visa/MC-branded debit card. Any thoughts?
American Express: Blue Cash Preferred (groceries, 6%; gas, department store, 3%); Gold Delta SkyMiles (Delta Air Lines, 2 miles/dollar, free checked bag).
US Bank: Cash+ (utilities, phone, internet, restaurant, 5%; drugstores, 2%).
FIA Card Services: Fidelity Amex (everything, 2%); Fidelity Visa (everything, 1.5%).
Chase: Freedom (rotating, 5%); Amazon (Amazon.com, 3%); PriorityClub (IHG hotels, 5 points/dollar); Sapphire (not in use).

*All cards are registered with PriorityClub IDine program for 8 points/dollar at participating restaurants.


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fffresh
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Postby fffresh » Sun Mar 14, 2010 3:43 pm

Debit cards can be scammed the same way as a credit card. What makes it more dangerous is that the fraudulent charges may cause checks to bounces if the account is temporarily overdrawn. It has not happened to me yet but I rarely use my debit card.

The situations you have encountered are very unusual, re: the harvested numbers on the balance transfer only card. Do you discard intact credit card statements in the trash? If not there must be an inside job going on and I would discuss it with their security department.

I believe all debit and credit cards are at equal risk but crooks prefer to target Visa and MasterCard because there are more accounts and they are widely accepted.

jeffysdad
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You're probably right...

Postby jeffysdad » Mon Mar 15, 2010 6:27 am

about visa and mc being targeted more simply because there are more of them.

I do not get any statements in the mail -- all online. All of my receipts and any statements I print are shredded before going in the trash.

After one fraud I asked how they could have gotten the number and the person said this kind of thing actually is common. I think you're right about it possibly being an "inside job," but the banks don't seem to care.
American Express: Blue Cash Preferred (groceries, 6%; gas, department store, 3%); Gold Delta SkyMiles (Delta Air Lines, 2 miles/dollar, free checked bag).
US Bank: Cash+ (utilities, phone, internet, restaurant, 5%; drugstores, 2%).
FIA Card Services: Fidelity Amex (everything, 2%); Fidelity Visa (everything, 1.5%).
Chase: Freedom (rotating, 5%); Amazon (Amazon.com, 3%); PriorityClub (IHG hotels, 5 points/dollar); Sapphire (not in use).

*All cards are registered with PriorityClub IDine program for 8 points/dollar at participating restaurants.

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Cucumber
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Postby Cucumber » Tue Mar 16, 2010 9:12 pm

This has gotta be an inside job! Someone can't just go randomly generate a 16 digit account number PLUS the 3 digit security code. What are the chances of that?!

I think the Citi bureaucracy either doesn't care/too incompetent to realize what you're telling them or they know they're at fault and don't wanna admit it.
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jeffysdad
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Could be...

Postby jeffysdad » Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:02 am

but the exact same kind of fraud happened with a CapOne card I had used for only one balance transfer, never a purchase. I was thinking either an inside job or the banks' data is getting hacked somehow. It seems like it doesn't matter if you never lose your card; you're just as vulnerable to fraud if you don't.
American Express: Blue Cash Preferred (groceries, 6%; gas, department store, 3%); Gold Delta SkyMiles (Delta Air Lines, 2 miles/dollar, free checked bag).
US Bank: Cash+ (utilities, phone, internet, restaurant, 5%; drugstores, 2%).
FIA Card Services: Fidelity Amex (everything, 2%); Fidelity Visa (everything, 1.5%).
Chase: Freedom (rotating, 5%); Amazon (Amazon.com, 3%); PriorityClub (IHG hotels, 5 points/dollar); Sapphire (not in use).

*All cards are registered with PriorityClub IDine program for 8 points/dollar at participating restaurants.

DoingHomework
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Postby DoingHomework » Fri Mar 19, 2010 1:17 pm

I've only had wierdness like that happen with a credit card once in the last 10 years or more. I'd like to think I am careful but in reality I am probably more careless that most people. The time it happened to me was after I made an online purchase at a "shady" place. Basically I bought some DVDs from a site that had MUCH cheaper prices than normal places like Amazon. I suspected they were pirated but figured I'd pay the few dollars and get them anyway. Within 2 days there were all sorts of charges for WoW games. I noticed it right away and did not have to pay any of it.

But what I found out was that there are groups in China that hack into email and sniff online transactions for card numbers. They then use them to play games to give money and other benefits in game land. Since they interact with so many game characters it is difficult to determine who the actual beneficiaries are. And, it turns out that the "shady" outfit I took the risk with was actually on the up and up.

In your case I would suspect someone hacking you, digging through your trash, or getting your mail. It does not sound like there is any way someone could have accessed your information two separate times if you only did balance transfers. I would be careful because if you are a frequent "victim" it could look like you are doing something wrong, even if innocently.

jeffysdad
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there is no mail...

Postby jeffysdad » Fri Mar 19, 2010 2:35 pm

because i get paperless statements. there is no trash because it is all shredded.
American Express: Blue Cash Preferred (groceries, 6%; gas, department store, 3%); Gold Delta SkyMiles (Delta Air Lines, 2 miles/dollar, free checked bag).
US Bank: Cash+ (utilities, phone, internet, restaurant, 5%; drugstores, 2%).
FIA Card Services: Fidelity Amex (everything, 2%); Fidelity Visa (everything, 1.5%).
Chase: Freedom (rotating, 5%); Amazon (Amazon.com, 3%); PriorityClub (IHG hotels, 5 points/dollar); Sapphire (not in use).

*All cards are registered with PriorityClub IDine program for 8 points/dollar at participating restaurants.

DoingHomework
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Postby DoingHomework » Fri Mar 19, 2010 5:48 pm

jeffysdad wrote:because i get paperless statements. there is no trash because it is all shredded.


Any chance you have a virus/trojan or someone has hacked your email?

It just seems odd that this has happened to you several times.

jeffysdad
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no

Postby jeffysdad » Fri Mar 19, 2010 10:43 pm

that's highly unlikely. I use a mac, for which few viruses are written.

BTW, this has happened 3x: once was with cap one; that was the card that had only a balance transfer and no other transactions. Another time was with a Chase card that I used frequently, and the latest instance was with a roughly 4-month-old card that I used exclusively at restaurants.

I'm not concerned about this costing me anything now or later. the cc companies are terribly blase about the whole thing; you just sign a form that says "these transactions weren't mine." Because of my spending pattern it's obvious that the fraudulent transactions are just that.

Still, it's a hassle and annoying.
American Express: Blue Cash Preferred (groceries, 6%; gas, department store, 3%); Gold Delta SkyMiles (Delta Air Lines, 2 miles/dollar, free checked bag).
US Bank: Cash+ (utilities, phone, internet, restaurant, 5%; drugstores, 2%).
FIA Card Services: Fidelity Amex (everything, 2%); Fidelity Visa (everything, 1.5%).
Chase: Freedom (rotating, 5%); Amazon (Amazon.com, 3%); PriorityClub (IHG hotels, 5 points/dollar); Sapphire (not in use).

*All cards are registered with PriorityClub IDine program for 8 points/dollar at participating restaurants.

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Mogul of Pineapples
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Postby Mogul of Pineapples » Thu Mar 25, 2010 9:11 pm

But what I found out was that there are groups in China that hack into email and sniff online transactions for card numbers. They then use them to play games to give money and other benefits in game land. Since they interact with so many game characters it is difficult to determine who the actual beneficiaries are.


I haven't heard that one before. It sounds like a somewhat sophisticated operation. I don't know how useful emails would be for them though. Most retailers mask your credit card number when they email you the receipt.

After one fraud I asked how they could have gotten the number and the person said this kind of thing actually is common.


If that's common then either customers are being careless with their card info or there's a big breach of security going on at the banks.
Disclosure: I am a moderator/paid staff of this site, which does have advertising relationships with some credit cards that are discussed and linked to. Regardless, anything I say is my honest opinion.

Current Cards:
American Express: Blue Cash, Simply Cash Bank of America: WorldPoints Platinum Plus Chase: Amazon, British Airways, Cash Plus Rewards, Freedom, Ink Cash Citi: Thank You Premier, Dividend Platinum Select Discover: More
Primary Everyday Card: American Express Blue Cash
Primary Travel Card: Chase Sapphire Preferred



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