Has anyone even heard of this happening before?

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RGI
 
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Has anyone even heard of this happening before?

Postby RGI » Fri Dec 21, 2012 6:43 pm

Please take the time to read through.

I have an Amex Gold charge card and purchased a product worth $10,000. The day of the delivery attempt was made in the morning while I was at work so the shipment was undelivered because I was not home. A second attempt was made the same day in the evening which I thought was very strange, at this time I signed for the delivery and claimed my package.

My product was not in the package, it was full of filler junk and an empty jewelry box. I called the number given on the website immediately and got no response, the second direct number led me to a technical support hotline. I contacted AMEX and the rep tried assisting me by calling them as well but multiple attempts yielded no response so the rep directed me to the billing disputes department to initiate a charge back.

I provided all the necessary information to the disputes department, and a credit was provided to my account.

Two months later I receive a letter from AMEX stating that they have concluded my investigation and that the merchant provided a signed copy of my receipt of the package with a tracking label and that they were siding with the merchant and that my credit would be reversed.

I immediately called customer support back and asked to speak to a supervisor, I then sent in pictures, documents, as well as legal codes which protect the consumers during the sale of items in which the merchant is the one who is able to chose which type of shipping method they use and whether or not they insure said merchandise.
Regardless, each time the merchant sent in the same information; Proof of tracking label as well as my signature of receipt by Fedex when the delivery was made and they continue to side with the merchant and refuse to issue a charge back.

What have I done wrong, and why am I being defrauded for $10,000 when all I received was a shipment of junk? This is looking to turn out to be a costly lesson for myself when it comes to buying online.

Thank you in advance for any advice you may provide to me.


CC Deville
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Postby CC Deville » Sat Dec 22, 2012 8:08 pm

Unfortunately it is a case of "he said, she said." The merchant has a tracking number as well as a signed shipping receipt. The merchant cannot prove outside of the signed shipment receipt that there was merchandise in the package (and doesn't have to since they have the signed shipment receipt) and you cannot prove that the merchandise wasn't received. You have to imagine that someone, somewhere has successfully defrauded a merchant or credit card company with a bogus non-recepit of merchandise fraud claim which is why the signed shipping receipt is enough for Amex to end the investigation.

Amex is not going to take the loss on this and the merchant is free and clear as they followed the chargeback regulations. For a $10K loss you may want to consult an attorney to see what other actions you may take; but it seems as if Amex has washed its hands of the dispute.

I guess in the future, luxury items such as jewelry should be purchased in person, or before you sign for the parcel, you may want to open it up and see that you received the merchandise before you sign. Either way, the situation is very unfortunate.

kcarter609
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Postby kcarter609 » Sat Dec 22, 2012 8:20 pm

That really sucks. I never accept anything that I have to sign for without opening it first.

Active Cards:
Chase Freedom 10+10 Visa Signature ($9k Limit - 8/2012)
Chase Sapphire Preferred ($10k Limit - 2/2013)
Chase Ink Plus ($7k Limit - 2/2013)
Discover IT ($9.5k Limit - 10/2012)
AMEX Zync (No Pre-set Limit - 1/2010)
AMEX Blue Cash Everyday ($20k Limit - 1/2013 - Backdate to 1/2010)

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djrez4
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Postby djrez4 » Sat Dec 22, 2012 8:23 pm

Sue the merchant.
[RIGHT][size=100]- Sapphire Preferred - Freedom - Ink - Platinum - Everyday Preferred -[/size]
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trumpet-205
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Postby trumpet-205 » Sat Dec 22, 2012 10:06 pm

Whenever you buy expensive stuff (computer, TV, jewelry, etc), you want to open the package before signing the package (and reject it if something is wrong with it). A signature pretty much means you accept the content of the package.

Like CC Devile said, your option now is to file a lawsuit at civil court.
In My Wallet:
Citi Forward (12/2010) | Citi TY Preferred (05/2011) | Chase Freedom (11/2011) | GECRB/PayPal (05/2012)
Discover it (07/2012) | AMEX BCP (09/2012) | TD/Target REDCard (10/2012) | Chase Ink Classic (11/2012)
BofA BBR (04/2013) | FNBO/Overstock.com (02/2014) | Barclaycard Arrival (04/2014) | FIA/Fidelity AMEX (04/2014)

jeffysdad
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Postby jeffysdad » Sun Dec 23, 2012 6:42 am

That is a very sad, and I'm sure aggravating, story, RGI. I have heard of people receiving boxes stuffed with an old phone book and the like instead of their merchandise, but I think that's pretty rare.

I'll go along with everything said above and only add that there might be some way to shame the merchant into making good. However, it sounds to me like this one is a bit less than reputable. It would be interesting to know who it is if you would care to share that.
American Express: Blue Cash Preferred (groceries, 6%; gas, department store, 3%); Gold Delta SkyMiles (Delta Air Lines, 2 miles/dollar, free checked bag).
US Bank: Cash+ (utilities, phone, internet, restaurant, 5%; drugstores, 2%).
FIA Card Services: Fidelity Amex (everything, 2%); Fidelity Visa (everything, 1.5%).
Chase: Freedom (rotating, 5%); Amazon (Amazon.com, 3%); PriorityClub (IHG hotels, 5 points/dollar); Sapphire (not in use).

*All cards are registered with PriorityClub IDine program for 8 points/dollar at participating restaurants.

UPS Gregg
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Postby UPS Gregg » Mon Dec 24, 2012 10:10 pm

trumpet-205 wrote:Whenever you buy expensive stuff (computer, TV, jewelry, etc), you want to open the package before signing the package (and reject it if something is wrong with it). A signature pretty much means you accept the content of the package.

Like CC Devile said, your option now is to file a lawsuit at civil court.


Packages that require a signature cannot be opened until the signature has been obtained.
Current FICO: 805 (Equifax)

Current Cards:

*USAA Platinum MasterCard CL-$1,000.00
*USAA Signature Visa Card CL-$15,000.00
*USAA Rewards Amex CL-$15,000.00
*HSBC Best Buy Card CL-$3,300.00
*Amex Macy's CL-$8,000.00
*JPMorgan Chase Marriott Rewards Premier Visa Signature CL-$20,000.00

kcarter609
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Postby kcarter609 » Mon Dec 24, 2012 10:43 pm

UPS Gregg wrote:Packages that require a signature cannot be opened until the signature has been obtained.


I guess that depends... I don't ask, I just cut it open.

Active Cards:
Chase Freedom 10+10 Visa Signature ($9k Limit - 8/2012)
Chase Sapphire Preferred ($10k Limit - 2/2013)
Chase Ink Plus ($7k Limit - 2/2013)
Discover IT ($9.5k Limit - 10/2012)
AMEX Zync (No Pre-set Limit - 1/2010)
AMEX Blue Cash Everyday ($20k Limit - 1/2013 - Backdate to 1/2010)

jeffysdad
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Postby jeffysdad » Tue Dec 25, 2012 6:48 am

I received a package yesterday and remembered this thread. I opened the package, delivered by UPS, before providing a signature. It was sent "signature required." The delivery guy didn't seem to have a problem with it, but I think he was a trainee/holiday assistant, so I don't know.
American Express: Blue Cash Preferred (groceries, 6%; gas, department store, 3%); Gold Delta SkyMiles (Delta Air Lines, 2 miles/dollar, free checked bag).
US Bank: Cash+ (utilities, phone, internet, restaurant, 5%; drugstores, 2%).
FIA Card Services: Fidelity Amex (everything, 2%); Fidelity Visa (everything, 1.5%).
Chase: Freedom (rotating, 5%); Amazon (Amazon.com, 3%); PriorityClub (IHG hotels, 5 points/dollar); Sapphire (not in use).

*All cards are registered with PriorityClub IDine program for 8 points/dollar at participating restaurants.

UPS Gregg
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Postby UPS Gregg » Tue Dec 25, 2012 9:08 am

We (UPS) aren't supposed to give the package to the customer until it has been signed for. When I was a newer driver I didn't really understand why until the first time a customer tore into a box and then refused the package. My supervisor wasn't happy that I brought a package back that had been opened. I had taped it back up but he explained that when that happens the receiver (original sender) could, and some have, think its been tampered with and that causes problems. He also explained that none of the packages we deliver belong to the customers until they have been signed for or driver released. Driver release is when we just hand it to a customer or leave it at their door.
Current FICO: 805 (Equifax)

Current Cards:

*USAA Platinum MasterCard CL-$1,000.00
*USAA Signature Visa Card CL-$15,000.00
*USAA Rewards Amex CL-$15,000.00
*HSBC Best Buy Card CL-$3,300.00
*Amex Macy's CL-$8,000.00
*JPMorgan Chase Marriott Rewards Premier Visa Signature CL-$20,000.00



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