Has anyone even heard of this happening before?

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jeffysdad
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Postby jeffysdad » Tue Dec 25, 2012 10:18 am

That's good to know, UPS Gregg. As it turned out, the item I received yesterday turned out to be damaged, which I discovered after signing and fully opening. Now the merchant is acting like he's going to give me a hard time about getting a refund. Just can't win.
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UPS Gregg
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Postby UPS Gregg » Tue Dec 25, 2012 2:43 pm

jeffysdad wrote:That's good to know, UPS Gregg. As it turned out, the item I received yesterday turned out to be damaged, which I discovered after signing and fully opening. Now the merchant is acting like he's going to give me a hard time about getting a refund. Just can't win.


I would visually inspect the outside of the packages and then test to see how well, or poorly (which is usually the case) they are packed before signing. If the package feels hollow and flimsy or the box looks beat up ask the driver to note that in the DIAD. That is the electronic clip board you sign. We are supposed to enter "PossDam" for anything that looks like it could be damaged in the remarks section. I usually am more specific. If it looks like the package wasn't packed well I enter "NotPackedWell". UPS, or any other shipper, shouldn't have to pay for damages that are caused by poorly prepared packages by the sender.
Current FICO: 805 (Equifax)

Current Cards:

*USAA Platinum MasterCard CL-$1,000.00
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*Amex Macy's CL-$8,000.00
*JPMorgan Chase Marriott Rewards Premier Visa Signature CL-$20,000.00

MemberSince99
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Postby MemberSince99 » Tue Dec 25, 2012 8:26 pm

Seriously, isn't this a legal license to steal? I mean say I'm a merchant and all I care about is my own bottom line. Why wouldn't I do this every time around and dare the customer to sue? 1% maybe will and a low percentage of that will actually win because what's the proof I didn't ship the item? Those are odds greatly in your favor as a criminal I mean businessman.

I've thought about it, and I have absolutely no idea why this doesn't go on more than it does. Also, with the credit card companies, if you close a card with them, why wouldn't they come back at you say 6 months later and say oh by the way you have a 5000 balance on your account which is due immediately. How do you prove that you DON'T have said balance since you cannot logically prove a negative? Seems to me they have a legal license to commit all the fraud they'd ever want, and they can blackmail you by saying we'll destroy your credit if you don't pay, and then they send it to the vultures who call up screaming they're going to come to your place and shoot you with their assault weapon if you don't pay up and all that lovely stuff.

Seriously, how is it this kind of legal fraud doesn't happen more often? It's basically legal ways to steal from people and there are a lot more of them than you'd think. If you have no morals this has gotta be THE place to be as you can get rich beyond your dreams. Sadly, I have morals so I won't be doing it, but I have no idea why more of these guys don't.

exdoll
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Postby exdoll » Wed Dec 26, 2012 2:41 am

I'm glad that I looked at this thread, sometime I buy on ebay comic books and other items for $ 3000 or order from online site's high ticket items. With ebay I can enter a dispute but if there was a switch on the sender side.... who know....what stoping a worker on the sender side from taking the product out and sending nothing or a ups guy opening package and taking the product an putting something like a rock or phonebook, its rare but it does happen , $10000 is a good pricing point to take a risk. Now, when I order a high ticket item I'm going to set up my outside camera to record me signing and opening up product outside at door with delivery man standing there.....

UPS Gregg
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Postby UPS Gregg » Thu Dec 27, 2012 8:22 pm

exdoll wrote:I'm glad that I looked at this thread, sometime I buy on ebay comic books and other items for $ 3000 or order from online site's high ticket items. With ebay I can enter a dispute but if there was a switch on the sender side.... who know....what stoping a worker on the sender side from taking the product out and sending nothing or a ups guy opening package and taking the product an putting something like a rock or phonebook, its rare but it does happen , $10000 is a good pricing point to take a risk. Now, when I order a high ticket item I'm going to set up my outside camera to record me signing and opening up product outside at door with delivery man standing there.....


Just make an unboxing video. There are tons of them on YouTube.
Current FICO: 805 (Equifax)

Current Cards:

*USAA Platinum MasterCard CL-$1,000.00
*USAA Signature Visa Card CL-$15,000.00
*USAA Rewards Amex CL-$15,000.00
*HSBC Best Buy Card CL-$3,300.00
*Amex Macy's CL-$8,000.00
*JPMorgan Chase Marriott Rewards Premier Visa Signature CL-$20,000.00

jdauria
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Postby jdauria » Fri Dec 28, 2012 8:50 am

UPS Gregg wrote:Just make an unboxing video. There are tons of them on YouTube.


This, I usually do this with all my electronics. Tablets, phones etc. Especially if its second hand
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MemberSince99
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Postby MemberSince99 » Fri Dec 28, 2012 9:56 am

UPS Gregg wrote:Just make an unboxing video. There are tons of them on YouTube.


But how does that prove anything? The seller can claim that you turned off the camera and removed the product then showed an empty box, or that you duplicated their box with an empty, or I'm sure many things depending on how creative they want to get. You can fake video to show almost anything - check out some of the "monster" or "ghost" videos, they would make Hollywood proud.

It's always going to come down to "he said, she said" and the crook already has your money so you're the one fighting to get it back.

jdauria
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Postby jdauria » Fri Dec 28, 2012 10:30 am

MemberSince99 wrote:But how does that prove anything? The seller can claim that you turned off the camera and removed the product then showed an empty box, or that you duplicated their box with an empty, or I'm sure many things depending on how creative they want to get. You can fake video to show almost anything - check out some of the "monster" or "ghost" videos, they would make Hollywood proud.

It's always going to come down to "he said, she said" and the crook already has your money so you're the one fighting to get it back.



This is true but would take a lot of effort to "duplicate" someone elses packaging.
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Future:

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UPS Gregg
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Postby UPS Gregg » Sat Dec 29, 2012 1:54 pm

jdauria wrote:This is true but would take a lot of effort to "duplicate" someone elses packaging.


Got that right. I can look at a package and usually know pretty quickly whether it has been tampered with or whether it was just re-used box. Besides......it's always "he said, she said" anyway.
Current FICO: 805 (Equifax)

Current Cards:

*USAA Platinum MasterCard CL-$1,000.00
*USAA Signature Visa Card CL-$15,000.00
*USAA Rewards Amex CL-$15,000.00
*HSBC Best Buy Card CL-$3,300.00
*Amex Macy's CL-$8,000.00
*JPMorgan Chase Marriott Rewards Premier Visa Signature CL-$20,000.00

MemberSince99
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Postby MemberSince99 » Sat Dec 29, 2012 5:10 pm

If I were a "legitimate" crook I mean businessman, I'd certainly have a lawyer (probably with mob connections) that I'd turn to for the fraction of the 1% of people who would actually dare to take me to court for my thievery (part of the cost of doing crooked business). That lawyer would point out how easy it is to fake anything you want on film just by showing Youtube videos I'm sure.

Gregg is right it's always going to come down to "he said, she said" because there simply is no proof one way or the other. So me, being a scumbag in my best 5000 dollar suit sitting in court telling the judge how every two bit loser wants a piece of the action I work so hard for and how I am a job and wealth creator and pillar of the community is going to look WAY better than some average Joe saying I deliberately ripped him off - yeah sure buddy EVERYONE wants a free payday your Honor.

It's so dangerous buying online for just this reason. To be honest the vast majority I mean 99.9% of them ARE honest though mistakes can happen, I have had thousands of online buying experiences with VERY FEW issues with any of them (it does happen, but it's rare) so kudos to the honest ones, I'm just surprised more people don't use this fraud as a means of "creating wealth" (for themselves of course).



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